It’s the inaugural episode of our punk rock RevOps show, Kill Yr Silos! Here, our RevOps Evangelist, Jason, talks to Andrew Lobb, Director of RevOps at Zinier. We went ahead and covered all the highlights from the episode for all the curious operators out there. 

Operators & Silo Syndrome

If you’ve ever been in any kind of operational or revenue role, chances are you’ve seen instances of Silo Syndrome and the effects it’s had on your team. We asked Andrew about his experience with Silo Syndrome throughout his career. 
 
Jason: What have been the signs of Silo Syndrome you’ve seen in your organization? 
 
Andrew: One of them is information hoarding. I think this happens naturally in a fast-paced environment because you have people trying to accomplish one specific goal who aren’t necessarily seeing the bigger picture. They’re hyper-focused in their area. 
 
I think the other piece would probably be a lack of overall alignment across departments. In a RevOps role, you’re working with marketers, sales folks, customer success, partnerships…and if there are a lot of projects on the table, we want to prioritize based on what’s gonna have the biggest revenue impact. 
 
Sometimes people in different functions are focused on their job and don’t understand that another department’s project could have a larger impact on revenue which is ultimately the end goal. 
 

Go to 6:40 to hear Andrew talk about how Zinier relies on the most relevant customer data to form and test hypotheses. 


Finding Gaps: Retroactive 

Jason: What are some common durability testing methods you would recommend to someone who sees an issue in their organization but isn’t quite sure what the root cause is? 
 
Andrew: I think it’s about peeling back the layers one by one. So if we’re looking at something like conversion rates, the first question that comes to my mind is ‘who are we targeting and how are we targeting them?’. 
 
We’re gonna look at things like activity, cadence performance, all those good metrics, and then from there, we start to benchmark across the industry. There’s plenty of that data out there that you can reference. After that, it comes back to the accounts and people we’re targeting. 
 
On the other side of things, when we think of a RevOps customer, durability testing is running through their day–almost like a rep ride, except you’re the one who’s actually running through to understand whether the strategy you’ve adopted into tools optimized for that customer. 
 

Go to 9:26 to hear Jason and Andrew talk more about durability testing. 


Finding Gaps: Proactive

Andrew: As far as proactive gaps, we’re always looking at things like pipeline generation and the precursors to that. We obviously need meetings to get opportunities and if we’re not seeing that happen over time, we’re gonna come up on an opportunity drought. So, as an organization, we need to put our focus on getting meetings. 
 
Again, peeling back the layers. Do we have enough accounts for the BDRs to be chasing and are they targeting the right folks within those accounts? So, if we’re not seeing enough meetings, the first thing we’re gonna do is really focus on the BDR effort, the AE, and the marketing effort.  
 
That’s where we throw the kitchen sink at it and say, “here are the top 10 accounts we’re gonna go after, let’s put all our effort into that from a marketing standpoint, a demand gen standpoint, all the programs, and then BDRs and AEs, let’s figure out account plans, who we’re gonna target, and go after them from there. 
 
Go to 11:06 to hear Jason and Andrew talk about finding gaps proactively through 3VC and setting momentum-based goals 

Legacy Operations to RevOps: The Big Shift

Jason: The mind shift between traditional operations and revenue operations is that we’re after a fundamental, sustainable lift. We’re not after solving every problem individually because we’re trying to up-level to something bigger. 
 
I think the people who are resisting RevOps are used to having boxes they can check off and say ‘okay, I’m done with this initiative,’ when in reality, the initiative wasn’t to do territory management in Salesforce, it was to improve conversion rates by 10%. What are some of the biggest differences you’ve noticed? 
 
Andrew: To follow up on that, I call them ‘light switch problems.’ For example, Sales may be saying, ‘if we fix this one thing, we’re golden,’ even if that’s not necessarily the case.  
 
That’s where the psychology part comes in. As RevOps leaders, we have to get those key stakeholders, department leaders, and even the end-users, to understand the big picture and overarching goal.  
 
So that’s something that’s super important when it comes to discussing our projects outside of revenue operations—tying it into revenue impact and understanding the lift that we want to see and here’s how we’re gonna get there.

The Personalized Buying Experience 

Jason: It’s time for B2B companies to realize that your customer is a person and every gap they experience means they will spend less money, have shorter contracts, or won’t move you across their organization because it’s too much political capital for them. Do you believe in the personalized buying experience?  
 
Andrew: 100%. It’s built into our pipeline process and our sales process to not only understand the business impact but the individual impact. Like you said, even though it’s business, it’s usually tied to a person. If you can find out what their pains are—and I’m sure their pains are amplified by whatever the company’s pains are—but getting to that level is so key in driving deals forward.
 
 

Go to 17:25 to hear Jason and Andrew discuss engagement scores and how to separate the individual from the account when measuring intent


 

Generalists vs. Specialists: The Swiss Army Operator 

Jason: I believe in a generalist mindset over specialization. What’s your experience with creating Swiss Army Operators and do you believe in specialization? 
 
Andrew: I’m definitely into having more range and the dynamic nature of generalists. Specialization kind of happens naturally in an org when someone is really good at something, especially when it’s having a noticeable impact. 
 
What I look for in an operations person is genuine curiosity. This is so important because people can go out and create reports and ship them, but if they don’t take the time to analyze them and have that curiosity to dig deeper and find out why this metric is showing up the way it is, then I don’t think they’re going to be as successful in this career. 
 
Especially if you have a wealth of knowledge in one area, working in other areas to help solve their challenges is only going to make your processes more succinct and make sure you can speak to the data that’s coming in where your job finishes and someone else’s starts. 
 
That pitfall of being very good at one thing and being pigeonholed into that is a little bit of a trap that people need to be aware of. Explaining that seeing the whole landscape just makes us that much more effective at our own jobs is key. 
 

Go to 21:08 to hear Jason and Andrew talk more about pushing people from specialization to a more generalist mindset and tips for hiring the right operators for your team.

 


Extra, Extra: Strategy Trends We’re Seeing 

To wrap up the episode, Andrew asked Jason about what kinds of new strategy trends he’s noticed coming up in this new selling environment. 
 
Go to 23:45 to hear Jason’s answer.